Transitivity Analysis of Hillary Clinton ’ s and Donald Trump ’ s First Television Debate

Halliday holds that all cultures reflect some universal meta-functions in the languages and proposes three such meta-functions: ideational, interpersonal, and textual. This paper employs the transitivity theory in Halliday’s Systemic Functional Linguistics to analyze the first television debate between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump. Specifically, through a quantitative analysis, this paper tries to find the answers for the next two questions: First, what are the distributions of six processes used by the two candidates; are there any similarities and differences or some rules in the distribution? Second, what are the reasons of such distributions, and what are the functions of the distributions of different processes and main participants in helping the speakers to convey their intentions? The main findings show that material processes, relational process and mental processes are relatively dominate in both candidates’ speeches; while compared with Hillary, Trump tends to use more existential processes. In political discourse, the speakers measure their words with special caution to interact with people, to expresses their attitudes and judgments, and to influence the viewpoints and behavior of the audience, which is mainly the realization of the interpersonal function.


INTRODUCTION
The emergence of language is along with the formation and development of human, and is inseparable from the practice of human society.According to Halliday (1967), language is used to serve a variety of different functions, and among which it is firstly used to express peoples' experience of both the outer world and the inner world of his own consciousness.Halliday's systemic-functional linguistics, taking the actual use of language as a research object and seeking to account for how the language is used, shows three meta-functions of language: the ideational function, the interpersonal function, and the textural function.The reasons why the author chooses a "functional" grammar are that the thesis is based on meaning and that it is an interpretation of linguistic forms.Halliday (2000: 41) points that "the aim has been to construct a grammar for purposes of text analysis: one that would make it possible to say sensible and useful things about any text, spoken or written, in modern English."This enables one to show how, and why, the text means what it does.
Transitivity analysis of text has been a feasible method of exploring different types of texts since Halliday employed it to analyze William Golding's the Inheritors in 1971.In the transitivity system, the world of experience is represented through six processes, namely, the material process, the mental process, the relational process, the behavioral pro-cess, the verbal process and the existential process.Because the transitivity system can provide a quantitative analysis of discourses, which is largely convincing and objective, many scholars have used this theory to do discourse analysis.These researches have given a profound interpretation about the data they selected.
Whereas, transitivity analysis has been mostly used in literature works and news texts, not widely involved in spoken texts.Recently, the first television debate between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump have drawn heated discussion, with its political characteristics, the speech discourse is quite different from other types.When the candidates construct their speeches, in order to achieving the goals of their political aspiration, are inclined to take advantage of transitivity, which reflect the main ideology in the society.Transitivity analysis has significance in analyzing spoken texts and it also needs more researches to reinforce its explanation on discourses.
Specifically, through a quantitative analysis, this paper tries to find the answers for the next two questions: First, what are the distributions of six processes used by the two candidates; are there any similarities and differences or some rules in the distribution?Second, what are the reasons of such distributions, and what are the functions of the distributions of different processes and main participants in helping the speakers to convey their intentions?This thesis moves from the meaning plane to the expression plane.It is a semantic system and the realization form of the interpersonal function.The relation between the semantics and the grammar is one of realization: the wording realizes, or encodes the meaning.

LITERATURE REVIEW
This chapter concentrates on Halliday's transitivity, mainly from the following three aspects: a. traditional grammar's view on transitivity and its limitation, b.Halliday's description of transitivity, and c. the components of transitivity.

Traditional Grammar's View on Transitivity and its Limitation
Transitivity is a frequently-used terminology in traditional grammar.According to traditional grammar, verbs are divided into two kinds: one is transitive, and the other is intransitive.The criterion of judging is whether they take just a "subject", or a "subject, and an object".Thus, sleep and cry are intransitive verbs, since they occur with only a subject (e.g.John sleeps in late every day.The baby cried for an hour.)Hit, and see are transitive verbs, since they need an "object" and a "subject" (e.g., John hits/saw Mary.).
There are difficulties with the traditional approach.For one thing, in many languages verbs cannot be divided into two disjoint classes in this way: indeed in languages as diverse as Mandarin Chinese, English etc. there is considerable overlap between the verb classes so defined.For instance, the English verb walk would fall into two classes, since it occurs in both configurations: e.g.I walked to the park, and I walked my dog in the park.Likewise in Mandarin Chinese, the verb xiao(笑)can be both "transitive" and "intransitive": e.g.ta xiao le(她/他笑了)"s/he laughed", ta xiao ni(她/他笑你) "s/he is laughing at you".Thus it is not verbs themselves that are either transitive or intransitive, but clauses.
A second problem with the traditional approach is that in many languages there are more than two distinct transitivity types.Not only are there intransitive clause types, but also, more significantly, languages show a wide range of clauses of intermediate transitivity, e.g.middle clauses, quasi-passive.
These problems are well known, and modern linguistic theories have developed a variety of ways to deal with them.Formal grammar tends to retain the basic parameters of the traditional approaches, in particular, the view that transitivity is a verbal phenomenon, and account for the difficulties by means of derivational rules, or by means of a distinction between deep and surface structure.Functional approach to this topic acknowledges that transitivity is purely a clausal, rather than a verbal phenomenon.Halliday (1967) holds that language has three meta-functions: ideational, interpersonal and textual.To him, the three meta-functions are semantic conceptions, and just like other semantic conceptions, meta-functions are realized with the help of language system, to be more specific, the subsystem of language.Halliday (1967: 38) also proposes that the realization forms of the ideational function are transitivity and polarity; the realization forms of the interpersonal function are mood and modality; and the realization forms of the textual function are thematic system and information system.

Halliday's Transitivity
Within the ideational function, the lexico-grammatical system embodies a clear distinction between an experiential and a logical component in terms of the types of structure by which these are realized.Just as Halliday says, a fundamental property of language is that it enables people to build a mental picture of reality and to make sense of their experience of what goes on around them and inside them (Halliday, 1985:101).Halliday uses "ideational function" to describe this characteristic of language.
The textual function represents the speaker's text-forming potential.It makes language relevant and expresses the relation of the language to its environment, including both the verbal environment and the nonverbal, situational environment, by a set of systems that have been referred to collectively as 'theme'.(Halliday, 2001:112).
This thesis is mainly concerned with the interpersonal function.The interpersonal meta-function of language covers all the ways in which we interact with people through language.This includes the basic mechanisms of interaction, such as turn-taking and interruption and also the ways in which we seek to achieve things by using language.These include, for example, speech acts (apologies, request etc.) and implicatures (i.e.implying).
As mentioned-above, there is a corresponding relation between the interpersonal function and the transitivity.Interpersonal functions act a lot on establishing and maintaining the social relationships between speakers throughout the use of language in daily life.Halliday observes "Here, speaker is using language as the means of his own intrusion into the speech event: the expression of his comments, attitudes and evaluations, and also of the relationship that he sets up between himself and the listener, in particular the communication role that he adopts, of informing, questioning, greeting, persuading, and the like" (Halliday,1973:333).
Interpersonal function is the meaning potential of the speaker as an intruder.Through the function, the speaker makes himself participate in a certain context of situation and expresses his opinions, attitudes and evaluations, and also attempts to exert influence on others' viewpoints and behavior.In addition, the function shows the relationships related to the situation, including communicative role like questioner and answerer, informer and doubter, and so on.
In other words, the interpersonal function in communication not only realizes the speaker's attitudes, his or her role, status, intention and judgment, but also influences the receivers' point of view and actions.The relationship between the speakers and the hearers is dynamic.Halliday's research on the interpersonal function is mainly carried out from the perspective of mood, modality and intonation.
The meaning of Halliday's "transitivity" differs from the sense of the term in traditional grammar.The syntactic distinction in traditional grammar oversimplifies or neglects some important differences of meaning between various types of verb and, therefore, various types of clause, while Halliday uses the term 'transitivity' in a much broader sense.In particular, it refers to a system for describing the whole clause, rather than just the verb and its object (Thompson, 2000).It does, though, share with the traditional use, a focus on the verbal group, since it is the type of process that determines how the participants are labeled.
A central insight of Halliday's model is that transitivity is the foundation of representation: it is the way the clause is used to analyze events and situations as being of certain types (Fowler, 1991).Halliday (1967: 38) argues that "transitivity is the name given to a network of system whose point of origin is the 'major' clause, the clause containing a predication" and "the transitivity systems are concerned with the types of process expressed in the clause, with the participants in this process, animate or inanimate, and with various attributes and circumstances of the process and participants".
We come to the conclusion that the three abstract meta-functions must be realized by more specific semantic systems.The interpersonal function is realized by transitivity and transitivity is expressed by more concrete semantic components.

The Components of Transitivity
Reality is made up of processes.A process consists, in principle, of three components: (i) The process itself; (ii) Participants in the process; (iii) Circumstances associated with the process (Halliday, 2000:107).These provide the frame of reference for interpreting our experience of what goes on.The concepts of process, participants and circumstance are semantic categories which explain, in the most general way, how phenomena of the real world are represented as linguistic structures.Process is the key element in transitivity, which can be related with one or more participants and circumstances.The process is the action, state or whatever that is being referred to, and is realized as a main verb.
Together there are six process types, namely, material process, mental process, relational process, behavioral process, verbal process, and existential process.
Material process: the material process is the process of doing.It represents the notion that some entity "does" something which may be done to some other entities.So what we can know or what we can probe is: what did someone or something does to whom or what?And it mainly involves two participants: Actor and Goal.The actor is the one who performs the action, each material process has an actor, although sometimes it may not be mentioned in the clause; and the goal is the one to whom the action is done to.
Mental process: the mental process is the process of sensing.It is the process describes what happens in the internal world of the mind that refers to such processes as thinking, imagining, wanting, liking, seeing, etc. Mental processes can be divided into three divisions: affection process(of liking, hating), cognition process (of deciding, understanding, knowing, etc.,) and perception process (of seeing, hearing, etc.,).In mental processes there will always a human-like participant that can feel, think or perceive.That is to say, the participant should be endowed with consciousness.This human-like participant is called the Senser.The other participant is the phenomenon, which is the thing that is sensed, felt, thought or seen.What should be noticed is that the senser is not only confined to human beings but can be any object, animate or not.
Relational process: the relational process refers to the process of being.That is to say, a relation is being set up between two separate entities, but without suggesting that one entity affects the other in any way.According to Halliday(2000:119), the English system operates with three main relational processes types: (l) Intensive "x is a" (2) Circumstantial "x is at a"(where "is at" stands for "is at, in, on, for, with, about, a1ong, etc.") (3) Possessive "s has a" Each of these comes in two distinct modes: Attributive and Identifying.
Behavioral process: behavioral process is concerned with such physiological or psychological behavior like breathing, coughing, smiling, dreaming and staring.Behavioral processes have no clearly defined characteristics of their own, so they are not easy to distinguish them from other processes.There is only one participant labeled as Behavior, which is typically a conscious being.In some clauses, there may be another participant: the Range, which is not a real participant but merely adds specific action to the process.
The boundaries of behavioral processes are indeterminate: but we can recognize the following kinds as typical: (i) [Near mental] processes of consciousness represented as forms of behavior, for example, look, watch, stare, listen, think, worry, dream: (ii) [Near verbal] verbal processes as behavior, for example, chatter, grumble, talk; (iii) Physiological processes manifesting states of consciousness, for example, cry, laugh, smile, frown, sigh, snarl, whine; (iv) Other physiological processes, for example, breathe, cough, faint, shit, yawn, sleep; (v) [Near material] bodily postures and pastimes, for example, sing, dance, lie (down), sit(up, down).(Halliday, 2000,139) Verbal process: the verbal process refers to the process of saying.Therefore, there must be someone or something functions as the role of the "Sayer" who gives the message.However, the word "saying" must interpreted in a broad sense.It means any kind of symbolic exchange of meaning, like the news says there is an accident, or my watch says it is 3 o'clock.Here the news, my watch play the role of "Sayer'', so the "Sayer" can be both animate and inanimate.Another participant is Receiver, the one to whom the saying is directed.There are also two additional factors: the first is Verbiage, which corresponds to what is said.This may mean one of the two things: (a) The eontent of what is said; for example, the truth in he told me the truth, a drink in I ordered a drink.(b) the name of the saying; for example, a story in my grandma told me a story, the name of a language in they are speaking Chinese where Chinese is a Verbiage.The second is Target, the entity that is targeted by the process of saying; for example, him in the teacher praised him in class, my intelligence in do not insult my intelligence please.
Existential process: the existential process represents something existing or happening.It expresses the existence and an entity without predicting anything else of it.Existential processes are different from other processes.Typically, existential clauses have the verb be, and the typical clause form is the there be clause, for example, there is an apple on the table.Has there been a call for me?The verb be somehow resembles relational processes but other verbs that occur in existential processes different from either the attributive or identifying.Such verbs are: the verbs that mean "exist" or "happen" like exist, remain, arise, occur, come about, take place, happen.Moreover, the verbs that embody some circumstantial feature, for example, verbs show the time like follow, ensue; verbs show the place like lie.stand, sit, rise, emerge and hang.Other verbs like prevail, flourish, erupt, can also be used in arrange of abstract existential clauses.There is only one participant in existential processes: the Existent, which can be any kind of phenomenon not only person, object or institution but also any action or event.
The circumstances are the things that surround the process, temporal and spatial settings, etc.; they are represented linguistically by adverbs and prepositional phrases.

Previous Studies of Transitivity System in Discourse Analysis
The earliest researchers who explored on discourse analysis could be traced back to 1930s when the London School founder J.R. Firth researched into the speech significance in context.The term "discourse analysis" in this field was first proposed by Harris (1952).To many linguists (Stubbs, 1983, Chafe, 2003), discourse is defined as "unit beyond the sentence"; and to pragmatics, discourse is defined as "utterance" (Schiffrin, 1994).Whereas, functional linguists including sociolinguists give the definition that "discourse is the use of language" (Fasold, 1990: 65).Functional linguists take into account the context of language use, the participants as well as a variety of factors related to speech activities and speech event participants.

Transitivity System in Public Mass Media Discourse Analysis
Even though most of the past research on transitivity analysis is literary works, in recent years, there has been also some exploration of transitivity analysis in news discourse and advertisement analysis.Fairclough (1995) holds that choosing which processes of transitivity to describe the course of event implies cultural, political or ideological significance.
Xin Bin (2005) applies transitivity system in critical discourse analysis.He makes a comparison between two texts of English news which depict the same event.
Huang Guowen (2001, 17) conducts some studies on advertising discourse by employing the functional theory especially used transitivity system to analyze the advertisement.He defines the purpose, the scope, the procedures and methods of functional discourse analysis and draws a conclusion that systemic functional linguistics developed by M.A.K. Halliday is probably the most fully elaborated and useful system for discourse analysis and various areas of applied linguistics.
There are some researchers who have made such research in transitivity analysis and give me wider consideration and abundant reference.To name a few, they are the transitivity analysis of EST (English for Science and Technology) texts by Wang Fang ( 2007), transitivity analysis of crime news by Yang Yunwen ( 2004), and the transitivity analysis of English media news by Leng Nan (2007).Those all analyzed different types of processes and the relevant participants involved in the process as well as their roles respectively.All of them have reached a clear conclusion that some features are salient in specific discourse in transitivity dimension.

DATA ANALYSIS AND RESULTS
To do a transitivity analysis, three basic tasks need to be done: to identify the process pattern of clauses, to identify associated participants and the roles those participants play.In this analysis, clauses including those embedded will be analyzed.
The percentage of each process types will be counted.With regard to the main participants, there are the host, Hillary and Trump.The host and the other circumstantial elements in the discourse will be neglected.
In Hillary's speech, there are 43 clauses, among which, material processes take up 37.66% as the majority, then comes mental process which take up 28.57%, relational processes take up 24.68%, verbal processes 5.19%, existential processes 2.60%, and behavioral processes 1.30%, as shown in the Table 1.
As for Trump, there are 59 clauses in all.He uses material process most frequently as well, which takes up 35.06%, followed by relational process 18.18%, and then existential process 15.58%, mental process 12.99%, verbal process 11.69%, and behavioral process employed the least, only 6.49%, as presented in the Table 2.
Material processes are processes of 'doing', which gives the audience a feeling of power and strength.As mentioned above, the participant as an Actor could be both human and inanimate, here which is a good way to describe that the country is in a passive state and the hardships that the new government faces.In both Hillary and Trump's debate, material processes are the most dominate processes to describe the situation of the time and the actions that the newly elected government will take or what the new president is intended to do in order to protect the country and to revive the economy.Compared with Trump, Hillary uses more material process, by doing this somehow weaken her gender and tends to give the audience more confidence to support her.
As can be seen through the Figures 1 and 2, relational processes take up 28.57% in Hillary's debate and 18.18% in Trump's.Thus, the analysis of relational processes is great of necessity.As the relational process is the process of "being", and it aims to describe the attributes of something or to identify something, we can see that the relational processes used here are all attributive mode, which is a good choice to use to describe the situation of the time, the economy and the actions that the new administration will take to win more support from the audience.
Mental processes also take up relatively high proportion in two candidates' debate.Mental process is the process of "sensing".It expresses such inner activities like the affection, cognition and perception of people.As is known to all, the present situating of America is not satisfactory, thus, their most important task is to carry out such recovery plans to renew the country.In order to propose smoothly their policies and let the people support the policies, the candidates should firstly make clear what they think and get the audience understand their thoughts.Though transmitting their own cognitions of the current difficulty, the candidates try to influence the audience's minds so that they will support their policies.To unite people's thoughts and strike a sympathetic chord in the hearts of the audience are the most effective measures.From the data, we can see that the sensers of the mental processes are mostly I or we.The use of I shows that the speaker is quite determined in carrying out the new policies More frequently, they imply the plural form of the first personal pronoun we, which indicates that the speakers want to summon the people to take actions together, and involve as many audience as possible into his or her stance.Hearing this, the audience will unconsciously accept his or her viewpoint and make themselves on the same side, which is just what the speakers want.Ultimately, people are the roots in the country, Totally, there are not very much verbal processes, existential processes or behavioral processes in both Hillary's and Trump's speeches.Generally speaking, this phenomenon is the requirement of the intention of the addresses.Because the candidates give the debate face to face with the people, so they do not need to use the expressions like "I am speaking to you…", "I am talking about…", these expressions will alienate the candidates and the audience.In the usage of "thank", the candidates expresses their appreciation for hostess and other usage of "talk" for speaking some fact.
Existential processes are processes to describe that something exists or happens without depicting any features of it.
The overuse of this process will give the audience a sense of monotone and hard to draw the attention of the audience.Extraordinarily, in Trump's debate, there are relatively more existential processes.The sentence sequence here intends to show the audience the disorder of the situation and through depicting the existence of such disorder, Trump implies that actions would be taken at once.Still, compared with the other main processes the number of existential processes is small, which are not often employed in the spoken discourses.
Behavioral processes are not quite often used in both the two speeches as they mainly describe the typical human physiological and psychological behavior like breathing, coughing, smiling and so on.Clearly, in a debate the behavior of some entities is not the focus.

CONCLUSION
The present thesis employs transitivity theory to analyze Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump's first television debate.All the six processes in the transitivity system are distinguished and counted.The percentage of each process and participant is marked and calculated.The quantitative analysis has proved that the transitivity system in systemic-functional grammar is an effective method in the political discourse.
The major findings can be summarized as follows: Generally speaking, material processes, relational process and mental processes are relatively dominate processes, while verbal processes, behavioral processes and existential processes are seldom used.
Material processes, with strong power and determination, are mainly attributed to describe the actions that the newly elected government will take or what the new president is intended to do in order to protect the country and to revive the economy.The widely use of we, us and our serves to shorten the distance between the speaker and the audience.
Since the present situating of America is not satisfactory, the new-elected president's most important task is to carry out some recovery plans to renew the country.Mental processes can help to propose smoothly their policies, to unite people's thoughts, and strike a sympathetic chord in the hearts of the audience.Thus, we can see that the candidates frequently employ I or we.
Relational processes used here are all attributive mode, which is a good choice to attract the audience's attention and enliven the atmosphere.
Compared with Hillary, Trump tends to use more existential processes.It shows the audience the disorder of the situation and through depicting the existence of such disorder, Trump implies that actions will be taken at once.
Because the candidates give the debate face to face with the people, the expressions like "I am speaking to you…", "I am talking about…"will alienate the candidates and the audience.Thus, the verbal process is not a good choice in speeches.
Typical human physiological and psychological behavior like breathing, coughing, smiling and so on, clearly, is not the focus in a debate, so behavioral processes are not quite often used by both the two speeches.
Through the analysis, the fact revealed is that no matter what linguistic forms chosen by the speaker, they all serve for the themes of the discourses.The interpersonal function that represents the speaker's meaning potential is the participatory function of language as doing something.This is the component through which the speaker expresses his own attitudes and judgments and seeks to influence the attitudes and behavior of others (Halliday, 2001:112).In other words, it enables individuals to initiate and maintain social contact, and to create a sense of identity for the self and the group.
Besides conveying some information, language is also used by the two candidates to interact with audience, to establish and maintain certain relationships with people, to influence others' behavior, to make clear their viewpoints, or to elicit and change others' attitudes.In political discourse, concerning more about interpersonal function can propose smoothly their policies and involve as many audience as possible into his or her stance.fight them.And we have a very good fight.And we have a winning fight.Because they're using our country as a piggy bank to rebuild China, and many other countries are doing the same thing.
So we're losing our good jobs, so many of them.When you look at what's happening in Mexico, a friend of mine who builds plants said it's the eighth wonder of the world.They're building some of the biggest plants anywhere in the world, some of the most sophisticated, some of the best plants.With the United States, as he said, not so much.
So Ford is leaving.You see that, their small car division leaving.Thousands of jobs (have been) leaving Michigan, leaving Ohio.They're all leaving.And we can't allow it to happen anymore.As far as child care is concerned and so many other things, I think Hillary and I agree on that.We probably disagree a little bit as to numbers and amounts and what we're going to do, but perhaps we'll be talking about that later.
But we have to stop our jobs from being stolen from us.We have to stop our companies from leaving the United States and, with it, firing all of their people.All you have to do is take a look at Carrier air-conditioning in Indianapolis.They left: fired 1,400 people.They're going to Mexico.So many hundreds and hundreds of companies are doing this.
We cannot let it happen.Under my plan, I'll be reducing taxes tremendously, from 35 percent to 15 percent for companies, small and big businesses.That's going to be a job creator like we haven't seen since Ronald Reagan.It's going to be a beautiful thing to watch.
Companies will come.They will build.They will expand.New companies will start.And I look very, very much forward to doing it.We have to renegotiate our trade deals, and (1),46-52.
we have to stop these countries from stealing our companies and our jobs." Host: "Secretary Clinton, would you like to respond?" HILLARY: "Well, I think that trade is an important issue.Of course, we are 5 percent of the world's population; we have to trade with the other 95 percent.And we need to have smart, fair trade deals.
We also, though, need to have a tax system that rewards work and not just financial transactions.And the kind of plan that Donald has put forth would be trickle-down economics all over again.In fact, it would be the most extreme version, the biggest tax cuts for the top percent of the people in this country than we've ever had.
I call it trumped-up trickle-down, because that's exactly what it would be.That is not how we grow the economy.
We just have a different view about what's best for growing the economy, how we make investments that will actually produce jobs and rising incomes.
I think we come at it from somewhat different perspectives.I understand that.You know, Donald was very fortu-nate in his life, and that's all to his benefit.He started his business with $14 million, borrowed from his father, and he really believes that the more you help wealthy people, the better off we'll be and that everything will work out from there.
I don't buy that.I have a different experience.My father was a small-businessman.He worked really hard.He printed drapery fabrics on long tables, where he pulled out those fabrics and he went down with a silkscreen and dumped the paint in and took the squeegee and kept going.
And so what I believe is the more we can do for the middle class, the more we can invest in you, your education, your skills, your future, the better we will be off and the better we'll grow.That's the kind of economy I want us to see again." Host: "Let me follow up with Mr. Trump, if you can.You've talked about creating 25 million jobs, and you've promised to bring back millions of jobs for Americans.How are you going to bring back the industries that have left this country for cheaper labor overseas?How, specifically, are you going to tell American manufacturers that you have to come back?"TRUMP: "Well, for one thing -and before we start on that -my father gave me a very small loan in 1975, and I built it into a company that's worth many, many billions of dollars, with some of the greatest assets in the world, and I say that only because that's the kind of thinking that our country needs.
Our country's in deep trouble.We don't know what we're doing when it comes to devaluations and all of these countries all over the world, especially China.They're the best, the best ever at it.What they're doing to us is a very, very sad thing.So we have to do that.We have to renegotiate our trade deals.And, Lester, they're taking our jobs, they're giving incentives, they're doing things that, frankly, we don't do.
Let me tell you the example of Mexico.They have a VAT tax.We're on a different system.When we sell into Mexico, there's a tax.When they sell in -automatic, 16 percent, approximately.When they sell into us, there's no tax.It's a defective agreement.It's been defective for a long time, many years, but the politicians haven't done anything about it.
Now, in all fairness to Secretary Clinton -yes, is that OK? Good.I want you to be very happy.But in all fairness to Secretary Clinton, when she started talking about this, it was really very recently.She's been doing this for 30 years.And why hasn't she made the agreements better?The NAFTA agreement is defective.Just because of the tax and many other reasons, but just because of the fact…" Host: "Let me interrupt just a moment, but…"